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June 2, 2008

The new Star Wars movies don’t suck.

I have taken it upon myself to tell you why. No worries, I’ll break it down for you nice and slow.

Before we begin, lets all agree that the original trilogy ( Episodes IV, V and VI) are good if not great movies and helped to revolutionize and invigorate film making as we know it.

There are a number of things that make the newest Star Wars movies okay:

  1. They aren’t boring to watch.
  2. They preface the old movies.
  3. They are technically amazing, much like their predecessors.

For the sake of brevity, I’ll look at the movies from an execution standpoint. No cross examining time lines, period correctness or whining about what color light-saber anyone had.

First, I do not find them boring to watch. Typically I fall asleep during movies that don’t hold my attention, but there are enough scene changes and cuts to keep me conscious and engaged. They also take place on a variety of planets and feature a wide variety of characters, just like the original trilogy. The light-saber battles in the new films put the lame swordplay of the original trilogy to shame. There are also far more vehicles and interesting architecture than what had existed in the original trilogy.

Second, the lead up to how Palpatine came to power and the formation of the Imperial empire is quite interesting. Additionally, you don’t quite get a good sense of chronology from the original trilogy, and I believe that the new trilogy helps to round out the genesis of the characters in the original trilogy. It tells you why Luke and Leia come from such different backgrounds yet are still brother and sister. You find out why Yoda is on Dagobah. You understand why Darth Vader’s real name is Anakin Skywalker and why all of the Jedi are gone. Everything just makes more sense.

Third, the amazing detail and incredible special effects are what made the original trilogy so powerful. Imperial AT-AT’s marching over the horizon, Speeder-Bikes careening through the woods and the Death Star trench scene are probably some of the most memorable moments in film. It was so wildly imaginative and so richly detailed, that it almost made you believe that this universe existed. The new trilogy is no exception and is born almost exclusively out of imagination and brought to life by hundreds and hundreds of digital artists. Pod races through canyons, an arena full of Jedi getting crushed and any of the battles with the Clone Army are all equally intense and compelling.

Does that mean they are flawless? Certainly not. I think that they wrapped up Episode III a little quickly and Episode II probably could have been shorter.

Could the new trilogy stand alone? I don’t think so. But as a supplement to the original trilogy, I would say that they are more than successful. In fact, if you have never seen a single one of them, I suggest watching them in chronological order by production date. (Episode IV, V, VI, I, II, III)

Think they suck and I’m totally wrong? Better back up your statements!

Filed by Travis on June 2nd, 2008

Um…Jar-Jar Binks?

Comment by Tristan — June 2, 2008 @ 6:11 am

What about him? He was only a big character in Episode I. Hardly a deal breaker.

Comment by Travis — June 2, 2008 @ 7:54 am

Jar-Jar was a huge mistake, to be sure, but he only hurt one movie, really. I still like the second one the most, despite the length, just for the various developments without pushing plot down your throat.

I don’t really see the technical aspect of it, though. There was a lot of CG in the new trilogy, but we already had movies that were entirely CG before the first of the series came out. Not to mention that the effort put into the technical side of things was nowhere near what it was in the first movies, which were actually truly groundbreaking (one thing that I can remember was the special effects director talking about writing software to actually display the “dot image” of the Death Star, when no real computer graphics software existed at the time.) You could also make the argument for THX, the integration of miniatures in an almost seamless fashion (compared to movies before the first three movies,) and so forth. The list goes on.

The new trilogy isn’t bad by any means, and is still entertaining, I just don’t see it as technically groundbreaking as the first trilogy.

Comment by Larry — June 2, 2008 @ 8:16 am

I do believe that Episode I was the first movie to be shot entirely digital. No film. That, I believe, makes it a technical achievement.

Granted, it is more of a first than an innovation.

Unfortunately, CG has really reduced the value of special effects in my opinion. Give me real explosions any day.

Comment by Travis — June 2, 2008 @ 9:19 am

I always look at it like this: if these movies were made first, would Star Wars be an international phenomenon? I would argue that, no, it would not. It’d be just another sci fi special effects throw away trilogy.

I can’t help but see it as 3 movies of almost nothing but fan service. Jango Fett was only there to feed off the popularity of Boba, all the while giving Boba a face that in the end ruins his mysterious background. Darth Vader was apparently a whiny little bitch who emotes as well as a piece of wood and decides to change sides based upon a feeling he might have had. Darth Maul was there to sell toys and then go away.

It’s to the point where I cannot fully enjoy the original trilogy without cringing at a moment or two from the new one. The dialog sucked and in the end it felt like they tried too hard to wrap everything up as quickly as possible.

The battles were neat though, but I was bored by anything in between them.

Comment by HP — June 2, 2008 @ 9:53 am

PS: “Nnnnnnnnnooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!”

Who green lights this shit?

Comment by HP — June 2, 2008 @ 9:53 am

I can’t help but see it as 3 movies of almost nothing but fan service.

I agree. But I wouldn’t call them boring, nor bad. Hence my recommendation of watching the original trilogy first, then following up with the new trilogy.

Probably could have done without the over dramatic “Nnnnooooo” but it was cool to see him crush everything in the room.

Comment by Travis — June 2, 2008 @ 10:22 am

Ok, Jar Jar Binks ruined things for me because he was there to replace the comic relief of Han Solo. I also felt like the entire first movie was marketed to kids, and the only reason Jar Jar wasn’t as big of a part of Episodes II and III was because of the uproar created by all the real fans.

I agree with HP that giving Boba Fett a face ruined a lot of the mystery, but it was nice to get the back story. I just wish it was a back story without a face.

Also the amazingness of the light saber fights in the new ones kinda messes up the later ones. Like why did Vader get so much suckier at fighting. And if Yoda could pull of some of that crap at 800 years old, why does Ben suck so much in A New Hope?

Also Hayden Christensen acts like he’s dead inside, which is only good for Episode III, and Jake Lloyd’s acting seems forced.

Overall it was good to seem them brought to life, but as expected they hardly measure up to the old trilogy.

[/essay]

Comment by Tristan — June 2, 2008 @ 11:56 am

I agree. Good to see them. The Originals are better, but the new trilogy doesn’t suck. We all seem to be in agreement and, frankly, I’m astounded.

Comment by Travis — June 2, 2008 @ 12:14 pm

I disagree with you wholeheartedly, but primarily in the areas of story development and the order in which to watch them. I have counseled several people in getting into Star Wars for the first time, and told them all to start with Episode IV, on the basis that you actually get more of a sense of how this whole galaxy fits together, and therefore are at a better starting point. If you never saw the original trilogy, you’d feel thrust into the middle of something incomprehensible with the new 3. This is aside from the fact that the story from the original three would run the risk of being overshadowed by the showy lightsaber battles in the new three. When those people I counseled saw all six movies in the order I suggested, and then came to talk to me afterward, they all echoed the same statement: the new ones were prettier looking, but the originals were much better movies (aside from one 10 year old boy, who I think was taken in by the flash).

As for the stories themselves…George Lucas actually admitted that he didn’t have enough story for all three new movies. He actually had just about enough to justify two movies, so he placed most of it in the first movie, and then split what was left between Episodes 2 and 3, which is why they both feel equal parts unnecessarily long, and too short. Jar Jar Binks aside, there’s just simply absolutely not enough story for it all. What I would have liked to have seen was have Episodes II & III condensed into one movie (which could probably have been easy to do), and then make Episode III about Vader’s coming into being the Vader of the original trilogy - dark, menacing, and homicidal from clear across rooms.

This is all to say nothing of the fact that Episodes I-III were filmed entirely on green screens, making it impossible for the actors to actually be any good. I don’t actually know if Hayden can act at all (I suspect not), but I’ve seen Samuel L Jackson, Ewan McGregor, Liam Neeson, and Natalie Portman all actually act in movies with real sets and characters they can see and interact with, and they’ve all been fantastic. But nobody was good in those new Star Wars movies. Nobody.

Add in the confused and pointless excusions with Darth Maul and General Grevious, and you’ve got a smorgasboard of pointless tangents that could have been streamlined into excellent movies. The new movies are fun to watch insofar as being flashy with impressive lightsaber fights, but aside from that I can’t stand them.

To Tristan: I just read a book called Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader. Thoughts on the writing style aside, the book was interesting insofar as it dealt with Skywalker truly assuming the Darth Vader Mantle - he kills 5 more Jedi with his own hands, and he has to learn an entirely new fighting style, because his suit restricts his movements so much that he’s forced to rely on a tighter, slightly more stunted style that’s focused on brutal force over finesse (which would explain why he goes from acrobatics to slashing down and to the side). And he keeps the blade in close to protect his breathing box thing on the front of his suit.

As for Obi Wan….I suspect because it’s been decades since he’s used the stupid thing. When you take into consideration that he’s been living in a desert and not fighting battles left and right, it’s understandable that he’d become rusty. And in the newer ones, Yoda never even uses a lightsaber, so what does that tell you?

Comment by Tom — June 2, 2008 @ 12:29 pm

…Oh, yeah, and sorry about the essay there. Got kind of carried away, I guess.

Comment by Tom — June 2, 2008 @ 12:29 pm

It has been brought to my attention I misread what order you said to watch them in. Since I can’t go back and edit my comment, I’d like to rescind that bit. But the rest of my comment stands.

Comment by Tom — June 2, 2008 @ 12:43 pm

And in the newer ones, Yoda never even uses a lightsaber, so what does that tell you?

wat?

I can see people creating all sorts of justification for the change in fighting styles, but all they’re doing is taking the facts and making up stuff to make it fit. Vader’s suit didn’t have to be movement restricting with the technology present in the time, and Obi Wan shouldn’t have lost that much of his badassness in the 18 years between trilogies (although he did age like 50 years in that time span, maybe he was living in some sort of worm hole, all Sarlacc jokes aside). I like to think Obi Wan kept in shape by defending his sammiches from Tusken Raiders.

Also, hacking and slashing leaves you more open than finesse, compare it to fencing vs. medieval sword fighting. I accept your explanation because I have no other, but I still hate it.

Comment by Tristan — June 2, 2008 @ 12:48 pm

PPS:

Anakin: I don’t like sand. It’s coarse and rough and irritating and it gets everywhere. Not like here. Here everything is soft and smooth.

Obi-Wan: [using the Jedi mind trick] You don’t want to sell me death sticks.
Elan Sleazebaggano: I don’t want to sell you death sticks.
Obi-Wan: You want to go home and rethink your life.
Elan Sleazebaggano: I want to go home and rethink my life.

Comment by HP — June 2, 2008 @ 12:49 pm

The prequels have their moments, but on the whole, are just bad movies.

Lucas seems out-of-touch with both the Star Wars fanbase and the movie-going public in general.

An abundance of style over substance drowns these movies. And when Lucas attempts to add substance, it is overdone, unnecessary, and distracting.

The dialogue, for the most part, is godawful.

It doesn’t help that most of it is being delivered by actors obviously being told by Lucas to “say it this way”. As Tom said, I KNOW for a fact that many of these people can act (except maybe Christensen…). But aside from Neeson and McGregor, everyone seems to fluctuating wildly between sleepwalking through their lines or making a ham dinner of it.

To bring up the point that Tom mentioned about “streamlining”, consider this scenario from “Clones”.

Count Dooku wants Amidala dead. He hires Jango Fett. Fett hires his shapechanging girlfriend or something. Shapechanger girlfriend sends a robot to kill Amidala. And the robot decides the best way to kill Amidala is by way of “assassin centipedes”.

JESUS CHRIST!

Comment by Mike P. — June 2, 2008 @ 1:50 pm

Another note, the best thing to come from Episode I was Weird Al’s The Saga Begins (the American Pie parody).

Comment by Tristan — June 2, 2008 @ 1:54 pm

When was the last time you saw a sci-fi action movie with good dialog? People panned the original trilogy for it’s campy lines and shoddy acting.

These bits, originally rusty and ugly, have turned into gold. Han Solo has some of the stupidest lines ever. But they made the movie what it is.

Leia: “I love you.”

Han: “I know.”

Comment by Travis — June 2, 2008 @ 2:11 pm

I would like to note that Christensen cannot act and has never been able to.

Comment by HP — June 2, 2008 @ 2:11 pm

Han Solo’s “I know” was paramount, on a pedestal with Vader’s “Luke, I am your father,” Yoda’s “Try not. Do, or do not do. There is no try,” and Luke’s realization that he wanted to bang his own sister.

Also, there’s a certain amount of campy acting in sci-fi that’s acceptable, especially if they’re clearly enjoying what they’re doing. But there’s a huge difference between “campy” and “shitty.” Alot of the dialog between, say, Han Solo and Leia was campy, but amusing, so it was acceptable and fun. All the dialog between Anakin and Padme made me wish that lightsabers were real, so I could turn one upon myself, seppuku style.

Mike: Awesome. I like it. Will the centipedes be strong in the Force, or just be regular assassin centipedes?

And if you want to see prequel done right, then go watch the cartoon mini-seres The Clone Wars, directed by Genndy Tartakovsky. That be some good shit.

Comment by Tom — June 2, 2008 @ 3:33 pm

Mike: I think Shapechanger girlfriend gave the assassin centipedes to the droid and told the droid to deliver them.

Comment by Travis — June 2, 2008 @ 3:43 pm

Well that just clears it right up then now, huh?

Comment by HP — June 2, 2008 @ 3:54 pm

Tom’s right. People should watch that mini series because it was the best thing about the prequels. it is amazing.

Travis. Really?! Everything that needs to be said has pretty much been said. Actually how about the subtle racism of jar jar, the trade federation, watto. That bugged me. Also I feel they half assed boba fett, anakins origins, and the death of the jedis. Boba’s a clone, anakin is the force jesus, and clone soldiers can easily take out the masters of the most powerful thing in the universe. c’mon

Comment by Ben — June 2, 2008 @ 3:55 pm

ohh yeah. The script is awful for any genre, sci fi or otherwise.

Comment by Ben — June 2, 2008 @ 3:57 pm

Do not want.

Comment by Tucker — June 2, 2008 @ 4:51 pm

Hmmm seems I’m showing up a bit late.

I agree with Travis. I enjoy the prequels, particularly Episode I. It’s too easy to throw stones at Jar Jar binks. Imagine for a moment that you watched the original trilogy for the first time today as the twenty-something that you are. Now tell me what you would think of C3-PO. He’s absolutely just as bad. In fact I would rather they gave Jar Jar a bigger role in Eps II and III and left out the god-awful slapstickery with 3P0 in that factory place.

The prequels gave us aspects of Star Wars that we never got to see with the originals, namely real Jedis in action. Darth Maul was spectacular and it certainly was a shame to see him killed so early on.

The newbies get so much crap for the poor acting and dialogue. Sure. But again let’s harken back to A New Hope…

Luke: (in a voice both whinier and more homosexual than his father ever was) “But I was going into Tashi station to pick up some power converters!”

There are so many groan worthy aspects of the OT (Jabba the Hutt, Ewoks, and yes even Chew-freaking-bacca) but we forget and dismiss them because “Hey it’s fucking Star Wars and Star Wars is great. period.” Star Wars films are what they are… glorified B-Movies, amped up saturday matinee serials. They are cheesey, they are campy, and they are beautiful.

Yes the original trilogy was blessed with fine performances from Alec Guiness and Harrison Ford and will forever remain my personal favorites but this doesn’t mean that the new ones are completely awful. Sure I have my gripes with the PT (mostly the discontinuity of tone) but I still hold them in high respect. In regards to Mr. Lucas I say this… There is still good in him. I have felt it.

Comment by Will — June 2, 2008 @ 10:02 pm

You know who would hate the prequels? Vanilla Ice. Nuff said.

Comment by HP — June 3, 2008 @ 9:53 am

I had a marginally longer comment prepared here, and then the Internet ate it. So the stunted version:

Will: It’s okay for C-3PO to be annoying, because R2-D2 is basically the Abbot to C-3PO’s Costello. Who does Jar Jar have? Nobody. Jar Jar only has the audience, who has to listen to him, and wish lightsabers were real so that they could commit sepuku.

And Vanilla Ice probably liked the prequels. Because they’d be “fresh.”

Comment by Tom — June 3, 2008 @ 10:37 am

Don’t you dare bring Vanilla Ice into this.

I’ll ban you…

Comment by Travis — June 3, 2008 @ 9:42 pm

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